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You’re the Executive Director and Chief
Operating Officer of the American Bar
Association. How is your role different from
that of ABA President?
My job is to run the operations of the ABA.
I make sure we provide the right support
to our members. Our President is in the
position for just one year. He or she serves
as the face and voice of the ABA. One way
to think of it is that I work the “inside” and
the President is responsible for the “out-
side.” We consult on a very regular basis.
You spent 33 years in the U.S. Air Force. Why
did you leave the military for the ABA?
I spent 33 years on active duty following
my commission through the Air Force
ROTC [Reserve Officers’ Training Corps]
program. I entered active duty in Janu-
ary 1977. I had a four-year commitment
and no intent to serve longer, but I really
enjoyed my service. After 33 years, I was
ready for something else. This job opened
up in 2009. I wanted something meaning-
ful and challenging, and this position with
the ABA is that and more.
You were the first Judge Advocate General
to hold the rank of lieutenant general. For
civilians, what does that mean?
Military lawyers are called judge advocates
and are members of the Judge Advocate
General’s Corps [“JAG”]. The senior JAG
is The Judge Advocate General [“TJAG”].
Before 2008, TJAGwas a two-star position
in the Army, Navy, and Air Force. Congress
decided to elevate the stature of the JAG
Corps, so they increased the rank to three-
stars, or lieutenant general in the Air Force
and Army. Because of some delays for my
counterparts in the Army and Navy, I was
the first TJAG to pin on three stars. Out
of some 365,000 people in the Air Force
at that time, only about a dozen outranked
me after that promotion.
In 2006, you testified in front of the
Senate Armed Services Committee, urging
greater human and legal rights for terror
suspects. Why is it important to extend legal
protections to detainees?
In my view, we had a duty to respect the
United States Constitution and our treaty
obligations. I also thought it wise to abide
by the Golden Rule—for this Nation to
treat those held in a captive status as we
expect our servicemembers who may be
held by others to be treated. Those stan-
dards are not lessened when the military
holds unlawful combatants.
What parts of your military experience have
been most useful in your current role?
For more than 40 years, our military has
been an all-volunteer force. The skills I
learned in the military transferred easily
to this job. In the military, I learned to
manage things and to lead people. I worked
with people, explaining what I needed and
why I may need it in a certain manner. And
that’s the way I work with the ABA staff
and our members.
Are there any military skills that didn’t
translate well to civilian work?
Not really.The management and leadership
techniques apply well in both contexts.
But of course, some things are different in
the military. It’s critical to have a highly
disciplined force, and military orders need
to be enforced. For example, in the private
sector, an employee can choose not to come
to work, just “because.” But a military
member who fails to show up without a
legitimate justification can expect a disci-
plinary response.
You helped develop three guiding principles
for the U.S. Air Force JAG Corps: Wisdom,
Valor, and Justice.What are theABA’s guiding
principles?
I believed that every member of the JAG
Corps should know what we stand for, so
we developed those guiding principles.
Similarly, the ABA has four goals: (1)
Serve Our Members; (2) Improve Our
46
JANUARY 2015
A PERSONOF
INTEREST
BY GEOFF BURKHART
Getting to Know…Jack Rives
Geoff Burkhart is a Project
Director at The American Bar
Association and a member
of the CBA Record Editorial
Board.